Artillery Quartermaster Sergeant

At the last local Joe club meeting last year, I picked up a Lily Ledy Joe. His sculpt is quite different from a traditional Hasbro sculpt, and looks at home on a western adventure. I have a small collection of American Civil War soldiers, and thought he’d look at home with them. The uniform and short sword are from Soldiers of the World, the belt, shoes and hat insignia are from Cotswold, while the Hardee Hat is from
Stevo’s Toys. The hat arrived today and allowed me to (mostly) complete my Quartermaster Sergeant.








-Nate

Nice figure! And completed just in time for the New American Civil War!

Nice !
I'd love to have a Lili Ledy Joe once.
What horse is that ? He looks good too.

SCU_HQ wrote:

Nice figure! And completed just in time for the New American Civil War!

They might find their uniforms and equipment a bit dated for such a war.

As a former sergeant and troop sergeant-major of artillery (2nd Field Regiment, Royal Canadian Artillery) I naturally take an interest in all things artillery, which though an essential arm of the service, never gets much attention in cinema or books or popular culture. I'm also a US Civil War buff, so this is doubly interesting. Finally, I have experience with the muzzle-loading artillery of the day. I won't go into all the details here...

The cabbage-cutter short sword being carried was based on a French foot artillery short sword of the same era, which was itself based on a Roman gladius. The idea was that if overrun by a cavalry charge, the gunners would lie low and try to use them to disembowel the horses of their attackers. If you think this sounds insane, it's because it was. They were however useful for cutting brush and the likes.

The light artillery sabers which supposed to be issued to horse and light batteries were perhaps even more unpopular, being overly curved and not even very useful for cutting brush and were generally thrown away and if light artillery units carried any edged weapons at all, it was usually the Model 1860 Light Cavalry saber.

The main weapons of the artillery are in fact the gun and the projectile, which was well recognized in the Union Army and so by order, in the Army of the Potomac for instance, by order, all swords, sabers and carbines were kept in locked in the battery's wagons or limbers during battle so that the gunners would focus on manning their guns. This would leave them having to defend themselves with sponge staffs, rammers and hand spikes if things ever got hand-to hand.

nice looking set of Blue Bellies

Wow nice soldiers Nate!

Kimono Troop Command wrote:

 I'm also a US Civil War buff, so this is doubly interesting.  Finally, I have experience with the muzzle-loading artillery of the day.  I won't go into all the details here...  

I sometimes joke that I was part of my college band’s brass section. That’s me looking at the camera, circa 1997. Two James cannons and a pair of pack howitzers are great at setting off car alarms!



-Nate

20200118_0049 by Gary Menten, on Flickr


One of two extremely rare Napoleonic era British 12pdr guns, restored by the Matross Detachment and used by by a volunteer group known as "The Westmount Battery." Both guns sat in Westmount Park for decades, on carriages that were rotting away, were all wrong and had wheels much smaller than they should have had. Both guns barrels were cast in 1810 and might have been used in either or both the Napoleonic Wars or the War of 1812. They were used as saluting guns by the 5th Westmount Battery, militia unit, at least until the 1890's.

The restoration included putting them on historically correct carriages and just to make sure they were safe to fire with blanks, inserting steel tubes into the bores as well as boring out new vents and reinforcing them as well. The barrel tubes have an eyelet at the top so that a plug with a padlock can be inserted into the barrels to keep people from stuffing them with their empty soft drink cans and other garbage should they ever be put out on public display again. Aesthetically, this somewhat bothers me, but i understand why it was done.

Note: 12 Pdr guns of this era were much larger and heavier than 12 pdr guns of the Civil War era...by about 1000lbs or so while Civil War 12pdrs were light enough to issue to light artillery batteries in the Civil War, these older guns as with the older American mod 1842 12 pdrs, were very clunky in the field and not as popular as lighter guns. According to our research, aside from the two guns in the possession of Westmount Battery, only one other such gun...actually just the barrel...still exists.

Kimono Troop Command wrote:

SCU_HQ wrote:

Nice figure! And completed just in time for the New American Civil War!

They might find their uniforms and equipment a bit dated for such a war.

Actually the new equipment seemed to be programmed to perfection, and easily achieved the initial victory....but the war's not over yet I think.
The impeached has just been replaced with the impaired.....

If there's one thing I don't do in these forums is discuss politics or express political opinions. There are lots of other places for me to do do that.

Kimono Troop Command wrote:

20200118_0049 by Gary  Menten, on Flickr


One of two extremely rare Napoleonic era British 12pdr guns, restored by the Matross Detachment and used by by a volunteer group known as "The Westmount Battery."  Both guns sat in Westmount Park for decades, on carriages that were rotting away, were all wrong and had wheels much smaller than they should have had. Both guns barrels were cast in 1810 and might have been used in either or both the Napoleonic Wars or the War of 1812.  They were used as saluting guns by the 5th Westmount Battery, militia unit, at least until the 1890's.

The restoration included putting them on historically correct carriages and just to make sure they were safe to fire with blanks, inserting steel tubes into the bores as well as boring out new vents and reinforcing them as well.  The barrel tubes have an eyelet at the top so that a plug with a padlock can be inserted into the barrels to keep people from stuffing them with their empty soft drink cans and other garbage should they ever be put out on public display again.  Aesthetically, this somewhat bothers me, but i understand why it was done.

Note:  12 Pdr guns of this era were much larger and heavier than 12 pdr guns of the Civil War era...by about 1000lbs or so while Civil War 12pdrs were light enough to issue to light artillery batteries in the Civil War, these older guns as with the older American mod 1842 12 pdrs, were very clunky in the field and not as popular as lighter guns.  According to our research, aside from the two guns in the possession of Westmount Battery, only one other such gun...actually just the barrel...still exists.

Great info! I know the James guns we used were originally smoothbores built at the Chicopee Foundry (right next to the Springfield arsenal) then rebored with the James system. The tubes were 885 lb and 887 lb, respectively. They were discovered buried in the early 70s, and got new carriages in the late 90s.

I’ve got a small 1:6 battery, and more small scale. The pair of Britain’s 25pdr guns from my childhood are some of my most cherished pieces.

-Nate

I have a Britain's 25prdr gun also, purchased on e-bay.  It replaces the original one I had as a kid, purchased on a trip to the UK in 1973.  Eventually, I mounted it on top of a wooden periscope my father had build me so I could pretend to be a submarine captain, and rigged it to fire by pulling a string.  I also have a Timpo 12-pdr, again a replacement for one I purchased in the UK in 1973.

The James guns, if memory serves were a less than perfectly successful attempt to convert old 1842 6-pdr smoothbore guns to rifles. The problem was that the bronze or brass brass barrels were too soft for the shells made for rifled guns and the rifling wore out quickly.

I think the barrel of the monster 12pdr in the photo is around 1800lbs...but I'm not 100% sure.

Kimono Troop Command wrote:

I have a Britain's 25prdr gun also, purchased on e-bay.  It replaces the original one I had as a kid, purchased on a trip to the UK in 1973.  Eventually, I mounted it on top of a wooden periscope my father had build me so I could pretend to be a submarine captain, and rigged it to fire by pulling a string.  I also have a Timpo 12-pdr, again a replacement for one I purchased in the UK in 1973.

The James guns, if memory serves were a less than perfectly successful attempt to convert old 1842 6-pdr smoothbore guns to rifles.  The problem was that the bronze or brass brass barrels were too soft for the shells made for rifled guns and the rifling wore out quickly.  

I think the barrel of the monster 12pdr in the photo is around 1800lbs...but I'm not 100% sure.  

Yes, the James guns were attempts to use older 6-pdr tubes until Napoleons or Ordnance rifles were available in quantity. I believe the bore diameter was about 3.67”. We were able to fire softballs out of them. Here’s my 1/6 battery. Marx, MPC and Topper Toys/Deluxe Reading howitzers.




-Nate

You have the Deluxe Reading field gun! That is SO COOOOOOL!!!!!

I kinda suddenly NEEED one!

Okay...now I'm jealous....

The 3" Ordnance rifle was in my opinion, the best rifled gun of the Civil War. I realize that the ANV had a few...five I think British Whitworth breech loaders, but they were too few in number to have any major impact on any battle of the war.

I of course love the 12-pdr Napoleon, which was more or less copied from the French M1857 gun, named after Louis-Napoleon, or Napoleon III. I got a major hard-on during that scene in the movie "Gettysburg" where they show the preliminary bombardment before Pickett's Charge.

SCU_HQ wrote:

You have the Deluxe Reading field gun! That is SO COOOOOOL!!!!!

I kinda suddenly NEEED one!

Thanks! It’s a bit beat up and doesn’t fire. The MPC cannon looks to be a scaled down copy.

-Nate

Kimono Troop Command wrote:

Okay...now I'm jealous....

The 3" Ordnance rifle was in my opinion, the best rifled gun of the Civil War.  I realize that the ANV had a few...five I think British Whitworth breech loaders, but they were too few in number to have any major impact on any battle of the war.  

I of course love the 12-pdr Napoleon, which was more or less copied from the French M1857 gun, named after Louis-Napoleon, or Napoleon III.  I got a major hard-on during that scene in the movie "Gettysburg" where they show the preliminary bombardment before Pickett's Charge.

I would concur on your opinion of the Ordnance Rifle. I have a thing for Parrotts, too. There were an even smaller number of US built breech loaders. I believe stonewall Jackson captured some at Harpers Ferry. The Napoleon is fascinating as it was at the tail end of French artillery dominance. The 1897 75mm was a classic, but from the Franco-Prussian war on, they would be facing a more even playing field.

-Nate

Kimono Troop Command wrote:

 I got a major hard-on during that scene in the movie "Gettysburg" where they show the preliminary bombardment before Pickett's Charge.

One of my favorite moments at Gettysburg is the epic defense of the 9th MA battery under Bigelow. Visiting the Trostle farm was a highlight of our trip.







We also found a 1/6 Napoleon that fires musket balls. I wanted to get it, but the missus made a stronger case for other areas we could use the money. Oh well.




-Nate

That looks like a Don Troiani painting....I've never seen that one, but it seems to my eye to be in his style.

I'm not crazy about Parrots. I think the 3 inch rifle was better, lighter, and safer to operate. Apparently though McClellan had a battery of the rare and huge 20pdr Parrots at Antietam. That's the only instance I've found them listed on any Orbat.

Of course, the place that will forever live as the battle where Union Artillery proved how effective an arm it was, is Malvern Hill. Still, they were in a way just copying what Napoleon used to do with his "grande batteries." Not war, but murder.

It's amazing that while George McClellan had the sense to assign one regular battery to each artillery brigade to serve as model for training and organization, he failed to do anything similar for his cavalry, which would have been very much to their benefit in the first couple of years of the war.

Now that is a spectacular scale model cannon! I just spent some time reading the firing instructions. They actually fire lead balls using black powder ignited by a fuse!

Wow great thread and photos Nate...

Kimono Troop Command wrote:

I'm not crazy about Parrots.  I think the 3 inch rifle was better, lighter, and safer to operate.  Apparently though McClellan had a battery of the rare and huge 20pdr Parrots at Antietam.  That's the only instance I've found them listed on any Orbat.  

Of course, the place that will forever live as the battle where Union Artillery proved how effective an arm it was, is Malvern Hill. Still, they were in a way just copying what Napoleon used to do with his "grande batteries." Not war, but murder.  

It's amazing that while George McClellan had the sense to assign one regular battery to each artillery brigade to serve as model for training and organization, he failed to do anything similar for his cavalry, which would have been very much to their benefit in the first couple of years of the war.  

Yes, it’s a Troiani painting titled “Retreat by Recoil”. Malvern Hill certainly showed the professionalism and effectiveness of Union artillery. McClellan’s decision could have been influenced by the better overall effectiveness of confederate cavalry for the first half of the war.

-Nate

Just a quick reminder of the devastating effect cannon had on personnel.
Movies, art works all seem to depict the smoke and noise of cannon in battle but rarely the effects.



Without a doubt the finest collection of 1/6 scale WORKING models of cannon, artillery pieces and other war machinery is displayed in a huge class showcase in the Chateau of Chambord, Loire Valley France. It was all given to the Comte de Chambord as playthings when he was a child.
I was surprised to learn that he attained adulthood with his hands intact, both eyes, let alone his life.
Here's a link to some footage I took on a visit. (Sorry it's so brief.) Well worth a visit to see this collection alone. Modellers eat your hearts out!

https://youtu.be/dBW20KhTESQ